E004 / Let's Talk Networking (in a Meaningful Way) / Sean Persaud

Written By Noa Ronen

In this episode of Peer Ripples, Noa and Ofir are joined by Sean Persaud, a leader known for his mastery in building and maintaining meaningful relationships over decades.

Together, they explore why networking often gets a bad reputation and how genuine relationships are built differently. Sean shares his approach to staying connected, creating value for others, and building a community of people who invest in one another over time.

The conversation covers authenticity, generosity, leadership, navigating new organizations, and the small habits that turn introductions into lasting relationships.

Whether you're building your career, joining a new company, or simply looking to create more meaningful connections, this episode offers a refreshing perspective on what relationship-building can look like.

Takeaways

  • The best relationships are built on authenticity, not transactions.

  • Consistent small actions often matter more than grand gestures.

  • Bringing value starts with curiosity, generosity, and genuine interest in others.

  • Strong networks are communities built over time, not collections of contacts.

Chapters

00:00 Networking or Building Relationships?

19:44 Building Relationships Across Cultures and Time Zones

24:30 When to Invest More and When to Step Back

30:19 Starting Fresh in a New Organization

34:00 Vulnerability, Authenticity, and Trust

39:00 Reflection and Takeaways

More About Us:

Episode Transcript

Sean (00:00)

liked how you changed it from networking, because networking to me, it does feel transactional. It feels like I want something out of my network. To me, you what I was thinking about? It's like when, it doesn't seem to happen as much right now, but when as you're growing up in a community, in a neighborhood that you've lived in for a while, and everyone is kind of watching out for everyone's kids, and everyone knows, all the parents know each other on a block, I look at my network like that.

Like how is it, how can I create a community of folks that I'm just in touch with, but we all know each other and it's gonna grow and grow and grow and grow. That's how I kind of picture it.

Ofir (00:37)

It's like our Sesame Street, right? Like everybody knows that.

Sean (00:40)

Yes, exactly. Oh,

Noa (00:43)

Are we ready to go?

Sean (00:44)

I am 100 % and I will try to keep- I will remember to keep my cursing

Noa (00:49)

You can

do whatever it's labeled as not for kids.

Sean (00:54)

There we go.

Noa (00:56)

Okay, so we have Sean in the room with us this morning. It's morning for us anyway, and I got my coffee. you get your coffee?

Sean (01:05)

I already finished my one cup, so now I'm on the water.

Noa (01:08)

So we are good to go anyway we go with the fluids. And we have Sean with us Sean Prasad. Am I pronouncing correctly? Yep. Very excited to have you Sean and I know each other for a long time. And one of the things that made me reach out to Sean and tell Ofir Hey, we have to chat with him is that

Every time I talk with Sean, he will never finish a conversation without saying, hey, when do we meet next time? So what I know about Sean is that he's the master, he's the chef of networking and not networking, it's really building meaningful connections. So that's what we wanted to talk with Sean today about. But first, Sean.

If you can introduce yourself to the audience that they can get to know you a little bit.

Sean (02:03)

So as Noa said, thank you guys, thank you very much for having me on here. Noa and I have known each other for several years, but again, name is Sean Persaud. I'll start personal first. I've actually just had my 30th wedding anniversary two months ago. my wife Suzanne, thank you, we've been together 30 years. Actually, sorry, we've been together 35 years, married 30. And I have three boys, 25, 22, and 18. The 18 year old is home from college right now, so we got a big disarray happening.

But that's the family world, live in Maryland, life is great. And then professionally, it's been a long journey, long career. Spent about right out of college, 16 years at Black & Decker DeWalt, right when DeWalt launched, a lot of cross-functional roles. Then went to Shark Ninja, which is a great phenom right now in terms of how big and successful that company has become and all the categories they're in. I was there about 14 years. Then I went to another company called Thermocell, another company called TTI.

lot of experience in the consumer durable space. And it's been a while of that.

Noa (03:08)

And also working in really large companies, Yes. Very large companies, which makes building relationships even more complicated, right?

Sean (03:18)

Yeah, but it's also a great opportunity because it's more people, like more people to interact with, talk, get to know, learn about, and also they get to know you. So it's also a great opportunity for that too.

Ofir (03:30)

you've shown in this entire journey, is this something that you always kind of had the tendency to build relationship and to maintain relationship or is it something that you built throughout your journey? How did it come about?

Sean (03:45)

You know, it's a excellent question because none of it was intentional. It's just, I think the first thing for me is just being you.

Like whoever you are, like Ofir whoever you are or me, whoever I am, I'm very big on just being me. And I think that's always run true, whether it's at home, whether it's at work. Obviously sometimes you have to dial back a little bit. Sometimes you can dial up, but I think it starts with just being you. And the reason I say that is,

A lot of the connections, a lot of the relationships, a lot of, you as we call network, it's just people who know me and they know, hey, the Sean that I will be in an office with that we might be in a meeting is the same Sean that's going to be if we're grabbing breakfast or we're grabbing a beer afterwards. I don't really change a lot. And I think that's a big thing because even as I meet new people and network with them and get to know them,

they might show up one way at work and then you realize they're a bit differently, they act a bit different when they're outside of work, not good or bad, they're just not always their genuine self. So for me, right at Blanket Decker, it started with just me being me and showing up how I was and a lot of senior executives at that time kind of latched onto that. And as they moved on, I moved, they pulled me along with them then I got to know more and more people as I did that. So for me, it's just being yourself was the first step.

Noa (05:06)

So I will poke a bit because, you know, a lot of, maybe I will box it, but I feel that a lot of people are afraid to be themselves. They are concerned about being themselves. So what can you say to that? Because, you know, there is this all authenticity, authenticity movement, yet some people feel it bites them in the dot dot dot. ⁓ So what would you like to say about that?

Sean (05:37)

You know, I agree and I understand that, but Marvin Ellison, who's the CEO of Lowe's, I was watching a speech or something he had given, this was years ago. And one of the things he said, it was advice to young people starting out in their career. And he said, look, your greatest asset is you. And by that, mean, you you can learn something and you can, you know, start to excel at that, but no one will ever beat you at being yourself. So if you could be yourself and then,

take your genuine self and incorporate into something you like when it comes to work and a passion, no one's gonna beat you because no one can outdo you at being you. And when I heard that, that rang really true because if you could find what makes, what's special about you, what you enjoy about yourself and you have that show up at work, no one can beat you at that because it's unique to you. So I always look at it that way. And if you could pull out what's inside of you that makes you comfortable and have that show up.

You have an advantage that no one's going to have over you.

Ofir (06:36)

Any of this change over the years, like without disclosing age, you talked about 20, 30 years ago, pre-cell phones, Today, most of those relationships are maintained on LinkedIn, text messages, right? It's really easy. If you want, it's really easy. It's very accessible. ⁓ Is it different today than it was before all this technology, when everyone were

on one hand in the office, but anyone who's not in the office, what's much harder to communicate with.

Sean (07:12)

I think it's much easier today because in the past your network tended to be the people you, if you go to an office, the people you saw all the time, the people you were around all the time. But nowadays your network could be anything through to your point, LinkedIn, texting.

email, you can stay in touch with people, you know, I'm on the East Coast. I could easily network with people in California on the West Coast and through even what we're doing right now. If I want to talk to someone visually, that's a friend of mine or a professional colleague, we could say, hey, let's have a Zoom call. That wasn't something that existed in the past. if, know, back, you know, call it 90s or 2000, whatever that, you know, those timeframes are, if you wanted to connect with someone on the West Coast, it was a phone call. There was no visual and it was kind of a plan thing.

Now you could be spontaneous. I think it's much easier to connect now, but on the flip side, it's easier to have these little cursory touch, like ⁓ feelers, but they're not really connecting. You're just throwing something out. And I get that from a lot of people through LinkedIn. You'll get this. It's like almost a transactional type of communication and you feel it and you know it. That's not really networking to me. That's just like, you're kind of, feels like you're one of many people they're reaching out to in a batch type of email. And so there's a downside to that.

Ofir (08:26)

Let's double click on this. What you're saying, you're talking about the difference between relationships and messaging that is part of a relationship versus transactional opportunistic reach out that is not part of a relationship Where do you draw the line between the two?

Sean (08:53)

You know, it's a great question because there was a point in time and Noa and I have talked about this at time where anyone who wanted to connect, anyone who wanted to talk, you open yourself up to that. That takes time. That takes an investment. When you're doing that, there's things that you are sacrificing, whether it's what you're doing professionally, whether it's time with your family, there is a sacrifice in how you're managing your time. Over the years, as I get to know more and more more and more people and there's more people in my circle,

in this, I don't know how this is going to sound or how it's going to come out. You start to realize people that genuinely are connecting with you and have an interest in you and really kind of care or have a concern about you versus transactional or kind of takers who only pop into your life when they kind of want something, whether it's a piece of information, whether they need help, whether it's whatever. And you kind of know that this is going to be a one way street.

You're gonna pop in, you're gonna ask me for some stuff. I'm gonna help you. You'll say thank you and then you'll disappear again. And then maybe when I reach out a month or two, I might get a quick response back, but we don't have that deep connection. So to answer your question, over a period of time, you start to sift out who are kind of takers and transactional and who are relationship builders that you're continuing to have a long-term relationship. But I do wanna say one thing, that doesn't mean you don't engage with people that are kind of in that taker mode.

They might just be in a bad spot where they kind of just need help, transaction help, because they're dealing with something. So, but once you start sifting that, that is very helpful.

Noa (10:25)

That's a very interesting perspective. I have to say, Sean, that how you approach the takers, ⁓ because I think I got burnout. I'm not using the word burnout a lot, but I felt like I burn out by the takers. And I actually got an advice from a person that was one of the best connectors I've ever known. And she said, you have to learn to say no to all the people that ask.

to meet with you, give them 15 minutes of your time, that's fine, you get permission from me. You cannot meet with every person for an hour on coffee, you'll burn out and you cannot do that. And with that, also not bringing that frustration that there are a lot of people as when you are a connector that people will want your time. And I'm wondering,

You know, something I'm sitting sometimes with is that when you are exposed to get to know a lot of people and some of us like you, it's like, it's fun. I'm working in a bigger company, so I get to know more people. But how you take that from getting to know people? I think for me, the craft that I would love to hear from you, how you get that from getting to know a lot of people to maintaining those relationships. What's your secret?

Sean (11:46)

Yeah, there's ⁓ so a couple. just want to go back to one thing you said. The person who gave you the advice about, you give them 15 minutes, but you can't say yes to everyone. I follow a similar thing. If I know someone's kind of a taker, I'm going to answer the phone. I will help them. It'll be like 15 minutes, 20 minutes. And then I move on.

Someone that I'm more invested in, let's say two people call me and they're like, hey, Sean, I'm really looking for a job. I do this, this, that, the other. You know me really well. Do you know of anyone that you can kind of connect me with or maybe have someone who has a need? The first person who might be a taker, I might be like, hey, know, yeah, here's this company I think I know is looking for someone or that company. Here you go. And you kind of have that 15 minutes and you help them and they're on their way. The person that I would invest in or I know invest in me, it's a bit more where

Okay, let's talk about your match. by the way, hey, the person I'm gonna connect you with, I'll send them a message from myself to, I'd like you to meet so-and-so. I get a bit more involved because I know that's a person that we have a stronger relationship that continues to develop. The other person I'm gonna help, but it's a short duration. So just building on what you said. Going back to your question, I think it's, as much as it's kind of natural, it also has to be intentional. And by that, mean, there's,

So for me, it's a natural thing, but there's things I do on purpose. And these might sound silly. Almost every morning when I get up, and this is gonna sound nutty, there's two things I look at. I look at LinkedIn real quick and Facebook. Not to check on people's statuses, whatever. I actually just see, is it anyone's birthday today? And if it is, I actually get a lot of joy out of not, if I'm not super tight with you, I might put something on LinkedIn, hey, happy birthday or whatever, or send a personal message in LinkedIn. But if I know you really well and we talk on the phone or whatever,

Nine times out of 10, I'll send you a text because that's more personal. It might be a funny type thing, but that's important to me because it's just, shows people you're caring, you're on their mind, you're showing up and being present in a moment in their life. That is something I do. The other thing is I try throughout the week to make sure I'm touching like five people in that day. And I don't mean like you're walking through your office, you stop by someone's desk and you talk to them. That's part of work to me.

But what I try to look at is, who haven't I spoken to in a while? Who haven't I connected with? And I just add them to that week. And it might not be a long thing. It might be a text like, hey, you got 15 minutes to catch up. Just wanna see what's going on or I'll update you with me. And it's a quick 15 minutes, but you're in their life and they're in your life. And that builds and it builds and it builds. And then also you learn a lot. Like, cause you live your life and you live it your way. As you're connecting with other people, you see how others live. You see how they approach things.

You see challenges they have that actually will put your life in a better context sometimes be like, man, I thought I had it rough. I'm now trying to help someone else through a really tough time. And it makes you really appreciate what you have. So I don't know if I answered everything, but you have to be intentional about it. And one last thing, and then I'll pause. can't, this is how I view it. If you reach out to your network with the intention of I want something from you, I need something from you, I'm going to get something from you.

That is very transparent. And that is actually, that is that transactional relationship that a lot of people will shut down versus just the more conversations you have, it might be you talk to one person that leads to something three people away from you that you don't even know. Next thing you're getting a phone call from someone that led to one conversation that was very far removed from that person. So you can't do it with the desire to get something.

It has to be, in my opinion, done with a good heart to try to help, and it comes back.

Ofir (15:32)

dying to ask you. Yes. How many text messages are you getting on your birthday?

Sean (15:38)

That's a good question. actually get a lot. I get a lot. And some of them are very, very funny, like very funny. ⁓ Yes, I get a lot. My other thing back when I used to work at Black and Decker or even Shark Ninja on people's birthday, if we were going out to celebrate, I'd buy them the nastiest shot. And I could tell you it's been returned to me and many, many times on my birthday in those times when I was working in offices.

All these little moments are critical. And by the way, it's birthdays, it's holidays, it's Mother's Day, it's Thanksgiving, it's Father's Day. I mean, it doesn't take long just to say, who are all the folks I know that I'm gonna send a quick message to? Connecting is very important.

Ofir (16:15)

No, makes sense.

Noa (16:18)

He's really good at that. He never misses on anything. have to say. I always at awe at his ability to just remember when I think about all the people that Sean probably knows. ⁓ And I will just share that the context is that Sean is coming from sales, but I don't think he uses sales like you don't use a CRM to maintain all those relationships.

And I know how many people try to create systems to maintain those relationships with no success. ⁓ Ofir, I'm going to give Sean a moment to breathe. I really want to ask you, because you work in a global experience, ⁓ what are maybe the two sides of the challenges and the values of what we heard from Sean? How do you approach that to build relationships?

Ofir (17:11)

I think that when you go globally, there are a couple of opportunities slash excuses, depends on how you want to look at this, that are a little bit different, right? And I think even, you know, even in when you live in the US, different regions have different kind of cultures or habits. But first, the most common excuse that kind of distract people from ⁓ maintaining those relationships.

is the time zone difference, right? By the time that I wake up, it's already afternoon there or the opposite. It's more challenging, objectively, more challenging to find time for this 15 minutes call, right? So you have to be even more intentional in this. The second part is cultural differences. ⁓ Different countries in Europe, in Asia, they're very different from...

the way that like from one another and from the way that we're doing business in America, right? If we're talking about context of meeting people, doing business, and then building the relationship and maintaining the relationship, different habits and different cultures of how to do it. And it's on you to make the effort to understand how business is done and how communication is done in each region.

⁓ What we're usually doing here in America in some places will feel very aggressive. ⁓ The generosity that you mentioned before, even to the takers, but also the aggressiveness of those takers is perceived differently in different places. So you really need to be conscious of who's the person on the other side. What's their background? Where they're coming from?

culturally, not just from the role and around that to build ⁓ those relationships. ⁓ Some places, if it's different social media platforms that are more common, different texting platforms that are more common. So you have to be more intentional to understand the other side when they're in a different country and to be more ⁓ intentional in doing this as far as kind of

obstacles like time zone and stuff like that.

Noa (19:38)

I remember Ofir when one of your people came here to the US and he explained to me that in, I think in Ireland and the UK, you don't drink after work like what we see in the US. Why? Because when you drink, really drink and you don't go just for one drink.

Ofir (19:50)

That's in Ireland. That's the guy.

The statement was there is no such thing as one drink, either you drink or you don't.

Sean (20:02)

That's the Irish.

Noa (20:04)

Yeah, so those are things that you also need to understand as a leader. If you take your people for a drink, what will be their response depends on the country they are from.

Ofir (20:14)

In some places people, in America it's very common to go for a drink after work. In some places people just want to go home after work. And when you ask them to go for a drink, ⁓ even when you travel and you're with them, they see it as not necessarily offensive, but they don't appreciate it as much because they just want to go home because that's what kind of the culture is. So it's really important to understand where you're going, both with customers when you meet them.

and with employees in your companies.

Sean (20:46)

Yeah, and I actually find that, you know, earlier in my career at that time, like if I take the Black and Decker to Walt timeframe, it was very much, ⁓ were all young, we all kind of grew up together, but after work, socially going out was a big thing. To your point right now, even in the US, after work, people want to head home and even, I'm gonna sound old here, but even some of the younger folks, it's almost like, wait a minute, that's an extension of work time.

that doesn't allow me to go home and enjoy my life. I'm now on the clock with my boss at a restaurant now having a drink. It's very different. So I also would say as someone who's a networker, you have to be conscious of that. So with that actually, what I, at my last company, I would actually do more like, does anyone want to grab lunch? Or just start talking and networking to people during lunch, or during the day, because you are at work.

But realizing that some of the younger folks after work, they're heading. They want to go do their own deal. They don't want to go and have dinner or drinks with me.

Ofir (21:44)

This

is a significantly different post-COVID. Yeah. It's really changed it and with the younger generation and post-COVID, combination. want to finish their work. They'll work hard all day, but they want to go home at the end of the day to do, know, whether being with your families or doing their own personal things. They don't want to stay with their peers. But this is where it's different when you do it within the workplace environments.

Sean (21:48)

Yes, yes, that's another one.

Ofir (22:14)

whether it's your peers or your employees, or whether you do it with people that are external connections, right? Your friends, okay, you moved on to the next company, but you keep those relationships. Then they see it as a social interaction and they have no problem staying after work because it's not work. Yep.

Sean (22:32)

The other thing I was going to mention, was something that you said that made me think about this. There's, and Noa, you and I have spoke about this. I try to visualize a conversation with two people is, and to me it's a transference of energy with, with like red being warm, you're giving energy, blue being kind of cold, you're kind of taking energy. So, so what I'm saying that is if you are actively trying to talk to people, network, be more present with other folks, you have to ask yourself, hey,

What in these conversations, am I bringing the energy? Like, am I someone that they will enjoy talking to and they're gonna leave there feeling, man, I feel more positive. And I don't have to consciously think of that, but I'm just thinking out loud here versus if you were a person that tends to be more like kind of complains, kind of takes energy, you're gonna have a hard time networking. Cause you might not even realize like, man, people aren't calling me back. People aren't engaging with me. And you have to ask yourself, what am I giving that person in the conversation?

versus what am I receiving? So if what you're doing is kind of putting your problems on them, you're gonna find a lot of people that like, I got my own problems and they back out versus if when you're talking to people, you guys are brainstorming your interest in the world, you're excited, they're feeling like you're energizing them and then they're energizing you. That I think is ⁓ a component of.

Noa (23:52)

Yeah, push versus pull. ⁓ I think, you we use the word networking, but maybe we should clarify that we don't talk about I'm just going giving my business card or QR code your LinkedIn and I want to get business from you or promotion from you or whatever it is. It's really about how do we build relationships?

⁓ that and the reason we really wanted to talk with you, it's not just one time conversation. And sometimes there are one time conversations. That's okay as well. But how do we maintain and sustain those relationships? And that's a real craft. And that's not percent networking for just one time transactional experience. And I wanted to ask you a question, but I forgot. I

Ofir (24:43)

have a question for Sean. Is there a time where you say to yourself, it's time to disengage from this relationship? Yep.

Sean (24:56)

Yes, and it actually becomes more of when I evaluate the relationship over a period of time, or look, we're all human. There are times when I kind of call people and I do need some help. I need like some advice. need whatever, like a lend a hand on something. And I realized they're not there. Like they don't want to engage in that way. And it might happen once, might happen twice. And it's not like they're not a good friend or whatever. I just, realized, okay, we have a different expectation in our relationship.

and I'll just slowly move away, not in an insulting way. There's no big conversation. I just realized, okay, that's someone I can't go to for that type of ⁓ help or need. And sometimes I'll just naturally gravitate away because there's others in my network that can give me that type of help or whatever. And particularly if it's a constant type of pattern, because there is only limited time. There's limited energy you have. There's limited investment you can have in all these folks. And you just have to understand who wants that investment and who doesn't.

And transparently, especially as I've moved up and up and up in my career and your network gets wider and wider and wider, you start to evaluate things a little differently. So that's been a big one.

Noa (26:02)

Yeah, and I want to mention that Sean is an executive. So no excuses that you can say that he doesn't have time. He doesn't have time and he maintains the relationships. And the question I wanted to ask you before and came back while you were talking is that the two of you entered the new organizations and there has to be some approach of how you navigate ⁓ the network.

of relationship when you join a new organization. So if there are leaders or even young people listening to us and want to figure out what they do, because right now the economy, a lot of people looking for jobs or starting new jobs, how would you suggest or mentor people around that space?

Sean (26:52)

about new folks coming into an organization or looking for new opportunities for their first opportunity.

Noa (26:58)

Whatever you think is important to mention for leaders trying to navigate network to build relationships for promotion or in the organization to start from scratch.

Sean (27:08)

Yeah, so I'll break it into two things. As a professional going into a new organization, like Ofir, I know you as well, I think the first thing is you've got to come in with humility. If you come in like, yep, I was hired at this level, I know all this stuff, and you're not investing and learning the company, the people, the history of why certain decisions were made, because you have to be respectful. There are reasons why a company is where they are the day you show up.

and you have to honor the folks that kind of got you there and understand why they're at that stage, it's important because then you're coming in and you're almost complimenting the folks that have gotten it to that point and you're making yourself part of that while you're understanding. Because to me, the first 30 or 60 days is kind of the listening, the learning, the evaluating, not coming in and telling people that have been doing something for a while how to do it. You will burn the relationships versus foster new ones. Regarding like...

people just starting to try to figure out their work path, particularly after college or something. My middle son is actually graduating on Wednesday in computer science and AI and gene learning and all that stuff. And one of the things that I've been explaining to him, his brain is not wired for utilizing the resources around him to help him. So I'm like, hey,

you Connor, you have me who has a lot of folks, like, I don't know exactly everything you want to do, but if you just give me a one pager of what would you like to do ideally and how would you describe it, then as I'm speaking to folks, I can say, hey, my son's graduating. This is what he would like to do, because I want it in your words versus me trying to summarize it, then I could socialize that in places that I believe and so can my brother. So I would say to young folks, instead of, man, I got to rely on recruiters or I got to rely on LinkedIn or I got to,

got to scour wherever to apply for whatever, take a step back. And again, I'm talking young, you're graduating out of college and say to yourself, okay, who are my friends? What are their parents do? And actually see if you could spend some time. If you have parents that are in a field or where let's say you want to get into sales and there's three parents that sell all different types of things, ask if you could talk to them for 30 minutes to an hour and show an interest in what they're doing, explain what you're trying to do. People have networks all around them. They just either,

don't realize it, they're embarrassed to plug in, they feel like they're gonna bother somebody, you never know until you try. And if you get rejected, so what you get rejected, but it's better than just having this thing in your head, you never know. It's amazing how much people want to help once you once you kind of put yourself out there and say, Hey, this is type of help I need, particularly someone new coming out of college. That's my and it separates you from what everybody else is kind of doing right now.

Noa (29:55)

And people have to talk about themselves also.

Sean (29:57)

All the time, all the time. The other thing I would say, and this is a little different for young kids or anyone looking for a job, you also have to remember if you're in a mode of a job hunt and you're reaching out to people and they're not getting back to you, they have jobs, they're busy, they have other things in their world that they're doing. Don't take it as a rejection or they don't have interest. Just be respectful that they have things in their day and you might have to ping them again a week later.

But just give them the courtesy of knowing they have things going on versus what you have going on is the most important thing to you. So you have to put all those things in context.

Noa (30:32)

Mm-hmm.

Ofir (30:33)

Yeah, I I want to go back to the first part of the question. I think as Sean said, it's really important to come in and understand that you don't know anything or, you know, maybe you have the professional background and experience, but you don't know anything about this company, right? So need to learn how the company operates, what the company is doing and such really important in two levels to build those relationships. First,

Try to meet as many people as possible, not just in your org, but cross-functional across the company. Try to understand their priorities, their challenges. Very common that you come across a clash of priorities. And if you don't have understanding of what other people in other functions are experiencing going through, what are the priorities that are being set to them?

it's creating friction that is just from lack of knowledge. So really important to meet and not just executives, right? Go and meet people that lead different teams, different functions. It doesn't matter what their kind of place in the hierarchy. They're leading a function that is important to the organization. You should meet with them. You should understand what they're doing. Get to know each other so they also feel comfortable coming to you and ask you questions. They will help you more kind of happily.

And they will also be able to ⁓ get support and ⁓ help you to really kind of be successful. They'll be more invested in making you successful. So building this relationship in your team with your peers, but also with the rest of the organization is, you know, all of those three phases really make a difference in your ability to build

to the future and then come in and start having a overall holistic understanding of what the organization is doing, but also where the challenges and opportunities are cross-functional.

Sean (32:35)

Yeah, if I can add two things to that. One is ⁓ exactly what you said. The one thing I would add is, it was when I do that, I always end with, how would my role help you? Because to me, it's always like, how, yeah, I'm asking you this question, but how could this role help you with what you're trying to do? That way you're enrolling them and they're enrolling you in this whole process. And the other piece is, I was thinking back to while you were talking, ⁓ there was a sales leader when I had started at Black & Decker and DeWalt.

The way I felt about him is the way I try to lead so people would feel about me. Yes, we had numbers, we had goals, we had things we had to accomplish. But what I was really doing, I was very young and junior in my career and he was the ⁓ president of sales. I was like, how could what I do make him successful? And that might sound silly, but he had invested in me. So it was like, yeah, I've got to hit my numbers or whatever, but how do I make sure what I'm doing makes him successful? And to me, that is the power when

when it's not like someone is working because they have to hit this number, they have to do this, they have to do that, where they're invested in, how can I make that person successful? Because that person is also invested in trying to make me successful. And you're working beyond something, you're working for something beyond just the normal measurements and goals that you have to hit on an annual basis. That's a lot of magic to me.

Ofir (33:52)

Yeah, I agree,

Noa (33:53)

Sean

Sean (33:53)

It also

takes being vulnerable to people. Sorry.

Noa (33:56)

Yeah, ⁓ Tell us more about the vulnerability piece.

Sean (34:00)

Well, if someone's gonna invest in you and they're gonna take it, and I'm talking, Ofir, you'd mentioned it's just not the level you're at, it's every level in a company. So if people are gonna invest in you, well, you have to give them something to invest in, which is you have to open yourself up so they know who you are. You can't, in my opinion, this is the way I look at it. If you walk around like this figurehead that is intimidating and walks around the halls and only engages when you need something and blah, blah.

You know what, people are gonna avoid you. They're not gonna wanna talk to you. You're like Darth Vader versus if you're walking around interested in what people are doing and not just the work, them, their families, they have pictures of their kids on there asking about their kids. I mean, these are genuine. I would never tell anyone to fake these, but the more you take an interest in people's lives, because if we just talk work for a second, people probably spend more time at work than they do truly with their families. So when you're acknowledging and appreciating that and ask them about their world,

That's shift change. Now I'm not saying everyone's open to that and you have to recognize some people are like, look, I'm here for work, not to be your buddy. Okay, that's great. But if you can inject some of that and also share of yourself, that's the vulnerability part.

Noa (35:11)

Yeah, and I think it goes back to maybe the first question of be yourself. And when you try to take the systems that you just shared and do that, like a robot, people feel the red or blue or whatever energy that like that someone is trying to manipulate them. We we are animals we smell when people manipulate us or try to use systems that are not authentic.

or they don't come from vulnerability and we just push them. So I do want to put here that everything that we all share in the end, you need to figure out who you are as a human being and how you do that. Because if it's going to be like a robot, people will not respond well to you. We feel.

Ofir (35:58)

it is a consistency, right? If you just come and make an act that you're that you care about them, but then come on down the road, you don't care about anyone. People pick up on this very quickly, you really need to come be going back. I think we're going back all the time to the authentic parts that you mentioned at the beginning. People pick up on this, right? And if you're really authentic, they will open to you, they will be vulnerable to you, they will want and cheer for you and want you to be successful.

And then you really create meaningful connections across the organization that can help the company be successful and all the individuals in the company to be successful. And then eventually builds those relationships that stay when people leave because there is something meaningful there between you and them.

Sean (36:45)

100 % here's an easy example. think all three of us relate to this. When you haven't seen someone on LinkedIn in a while and all of a sudden you're seeing them every day pop up and post something. I normally look at it right, they must be looking for a job. Something must be going on because their pattern has absolutely changed and you can see it. You can sense it. Quickly you could feel it. And it's similar to what you're saying.

Noa (37:07)

That's a good one and people should pay attention to what you just said. So we are getting into that wrapping up part and in that part we take a moment to reflect on the conversation and each one of us shares one key takeaway that we take from the conversation today. Sounds good, Sean, ready to play with us?

Sean (37:11)

100 %

I am? Can I add just one thing before we do that?

Noa (37:32)

No.

Sean (37:34)

I

was thinking about, ⁓ you know, the other thing to me is you have to, this is how I feel, I can't say you have to, but this is just how it is for me. I don't know if you remember that movie Hitch with, my gosh, Will Smith. He was basically a matchmaker, him and Margaret Robbie. yeah, yeah. And so they were matchmakers. When I look at my connections, network, any of that stuff, if someone calls me, whether they need help, whatever, whatever,

My mind is quickly almost cataloging, well, wait a minute, who do I know in my world that I can connect them with that can help them with either figuring out something, help them with whatever problem they're trying to achieve, or if they're trying to get into a particular field. I'm constantly like, how could I bring these folks together? Because I feel they can get value in a conversation with each other. And I think for me anyway, that's a big part of it. I get nothing out of it except the joy of connecting some folks.

or even when recruiters call, I'm like, hey, that's not for me, but I'll give you three other people. And by the way, call me if you ever need anything, because I got a ton of people I'd like to recommend. So I'm saying that because I think it's important to look at it from a standpoint of not what can I get, but how can I help people? And I think if you approach it in that way, things will grow very quickly and you're not even gonna realize it, because you're putting a lot out there. So anyway, I just wanted to say that part.

Noa (38:54)

Love your energy. Yeah. So who wants to play first key takeaways from the conversation today?

Sean (38:55)

That's it.

Ofir (39:03)

can start because I'm going with this authentic and generous. ⁓ These two words are kind of going throughout this conversation. ⁓ Really important to be authentic, really easy to call on someone who's not, who's faking it. ⁓ And I'm really taking the approach of generosity even to the takers. That's something that

⁓ I wouldn't think about naturally and I'm definitely taking this with me from this conversation.

Noa (39:40)

That was really cool.

Sean (39:43)

⁓ I'll go and for me, you have to be intentional about it until it becomes something that's natural. Just like if you're working out and you're lifting, you're gonna start off, it's gonna be very challenging, you're gonna be not as strong, but if you just stay consistent with it daily, you're gonna find in 30 days, your network is gonna grow and you're gonna start getting opportunities and conversations that you never would have gotten in the past. So I think being consistent.

being genuine about it, intentional. And I'll give you another thing I do. I try almost every day to connect with two to five people on LinkedIn. Just throw out an invite. And not like some strangers, but it could be a connection of a friend or a connection of this, because the more you put out, the more you do receive. and whether it's LinkedIn or whether it's something else. So intentionality with a good heart to me is very important.

Noa (40:38)

Yeah. And it's funny, Ofer, I thought you're going to say that, but I went with value because fear is all about is in customer success space. So it's always about what's the value. ⁓ So I think I stayed with what is the value that I can bring to people's life. And it comes for me with not again, that transactional of like, how can I bring them value? So they will give something to me, but how can I learn and be curious?

about how can I bring them value? And that's a different conversation from one person to another to really understand that. So it's the value, but not from transactional space, but from that curiosity. And for me, that moment when I said, Hey, you worked in really big organizations and you said, yes, but it allowed me to get to know so many people. I think this is the main distinction between, that's exhausting. That's not fun. That's transaction to

to the value and curiosity. So thank you for that inspiration, Sean. I learned a ton from you today. really? Thank you, yeah.

Sean (41:48)

Well, thank

I will say, Noa, based off of one thing that you said, or some of the things you said, I would also say that, you know, there are people that it's exhausting to network. And I think for, or to put yourself out there and reach out. And I think, and I'm going to be an Enneagram person for a second. I worked with two people that were Enneagram ones, which are more like their task focus. Like they want to get something done. Noa, you'd be able to explain it way more than me.

Noa (42:13)

No, not with Enneagram actually.

Sean (42:16)

To them, it's almost like a chore to do that. But I think the important thing for people to ask themselves is, well, why would you be doing it? If you think you're doing it because I just need something, but I don't need something right now, so don't need to do it, that's not necessarily, I wouldn't necessarily encourage people to look at it that way. The way I would encourage people to look at it, Noa when you said this is what triggered me is, if you're in a pursuit of constantly wanting to learn or improve yourself, you could stay in your lane and try to do it on your own.

but all the folks around you, they all have unique pieces of knowledge. The more you could have conversation and plug into some of their knowledge, you're just gonna add more tools to your toolbox. So you could look at reaching out as, it's a chore, but you could also look at it as a self-development tool to help yourself learn more versus podcast. And I mean, you can do all these other things, podcasts, AI tools, whatever, but you have humans around you that can help you. And a lot of them would like to.

And that's another way to look at it too. So anyway.

Noa (43:18)

Yeah. So with that, we hope that this podcast episode will be shared with any person in this network so people can have a good conversation, not with their CHATGPT to say, hey, tell me how I can do that as Sean explained in three bullet points, but to share that with their teams, with their peers, with their kids, with their grandparents, and have a good peer conversation like we had here today.

Ofir (43:50)

Sean, you need to share this episode with every person that have a birthday.

Sean (43:55)

There you go, yes! And they're gonna know my tricks. They're gonna be like, you don't remember it all in your head. You just get an alert or you check it every day.

Noa (44:04)

There is network with value. So Sean, thank you so, much for taking time from your busy schedule to be with us. And I hope people got what they need from this conversation. And thank you both for a great, great, meaningful, intentional, with value conversation.

Ofir (44:23)

Thank you, Sean.

Sean (44:25)

you guys this was great really appreciate this was fun this and that by the way that hour flew by quickly

Noa Ronen
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E003 / Let's Talk Space / Noa Ronen & Ofir Ronen